Hey all,
So I recently decided to go vegan. My personal reasons for ditching animal products were because of environmental factors, animal welfare, and trying to maintain consistency with the values I hold to their logical ends.
I was curious. I’ve seen a lot of hate towards vegans online, admittedly being someone who partook in that several years ago myself to a small degree. While I’m glad and very lucky people I know closely have been making accommodations for me, I’m also worried about mentioning or bringing it up to people I’m getting to know since I don’t want to rub them the wrong way if they possibly have these notions that being vegan and veganism are a bad thing. Namely when it’s relevant in conversation like people asking me why I read ingredients lists or can’t have something they’re offering me, which I’ve been half-lying attributing to food allergies and intolerances out of worry (I’m lactose intolerant, which helps as a cop-out).
I’m wanting to know what people dislike about vegans, whether they’re based on previous experiences they’ve had, or preconceived notions, and what would make someone a “good vegan” in their eyes. I know I shouldn’t be a people-pleaser, but knowing this stuff would definitely help me gain the confidence to be more open about myself and my personal values to others who don’t necessarily share said values.
Thanks in advance, I’ll try to respond where possible, but it’s going to be a busy day for me, though I do read all replies to posts I make.
My sister in law is vegan. She is the most normal person about it I’ve ever met. She doesn’t talk about it unless it comes up in conversation in a normal way.
She doesn’t proclaim it, because its part of who she is it isn’t the whole of who she is. She also understands that other people’s choices are theirs and she doesn’t need to convert them, or defend her own position.
When we have family gatherings, we try to accommodate with food offerings, but she says we don’t need to and always brings her own food and extra to share. This is important because she’s self sufficient and doesn’t expect anybody to adjust their life to match her choices. Likewise, between diets and allergies we as a family just always ensure people know what is in what.
These are just simple examples. My point being, I don’t think of her as vegan. I think of her as my sister in law. Be a normal person and its all good. If its not, then that’s not on you. There are jerk vegans and jerk non-vegans. Don’t be a jerk. Don’t tolerate jerks in return.
accept the fact that, even if it works for you, not everyone would be willing to switch to that lifestyle. And that’s ok!
The same way you be a “good religious person” - don’t fucking proselytize. It’s your choice, and that’s great, but you don’t need to force it onto others.
I know a lot o vegans, they are all chill. On their daily life, to be vegan is a a non-issue, for themselves and others.
On social events we generally have some extra options to accommodate them, and that’s it.
So, for yourself, you probably need to do some planning ahead to be sure that the place where you are going will have options, or, if the event will be on someone’s house, check with the host if they will offer (or if you can bring) something suitable for you.
If you are not trying to force other people to live your lifestyle, guilt-trip them or show yourself as moral superior to others, them you already are a “good vegan”.
And, if you want to invite people to be like you, do it by offering/showing tasty animal-free food to your guests as an option.
You just do you. I think when people say “bad” they generally mean preachy. That is not most vegans. Just live your life, eat what you want, bring good food to potlucks so that you know you’ll have something.
I will add that mentioning it is not preachy, if you get an overreaction it’s not you. I am omnivorous and would want someone to tell me before a party or outing so that I don’t accidentally invite them to a steakhouse or BBQ joint. I often make vegan food for potlucks just because it’s sort of a baseline, most everyone can eat it.
There’s probably an element of “read the room”. I’m open to trying something new or different to me, have enjoyed many meals that happen to not include animal products, and will be offended if you let me be a bad host by lack of communication. But I certainly know all too many fellow carnivores who will be offended at the mere mention
I don’t think there are good arguments for eating meat, and I think people get mad at vegans because of the cognitive dissonance. “If eating meat is bad, and I eat meat, then I’m bad. But I’m not bad! They must be bad! They suck!”
Sometimes you see this with other things. Like if someone walks or takes a bike instead of driving for the environment. “If driving is bad for the environment, and I do a lot of driving, I’m doing bad. But I’m a good person! Fuck them for making me feel bad!”
Most people are just large children.
Sometimes people try to justify eating meat. Some reasons are more defensible than others. Someone with severe allergies might have trouble getting nutrition from vegan options. Someone saying “but I enjoy it” is acting like a child.
In short, most people are operating mostly on emotional levels. Facts don’t really matter. Feelings drive them. I think this is the root of most of our problems, honestly, that people can’t put aside their emotions.
Personally, I try to minimize how much meat I eat, but I’m okay with accepting sometimes I do bad things.
Yeah I think “evangelical vegans” or “bad vegans” are a sort of caricature made for comedians and then everyone else to punch down on. Sure annoying vegans exist, and so do annoying meat eating people, but diet isn’t necessarily why these people are annoying.
I imagine there’s also an element of defensiveness from meat eaters as well. Even reasonably stating “I don’t eat meat because of the cruelty in the industry and the negative environmental impacts” is implicitly challenging a meat eater to consider those things, which they likely never have. And being faced with the certainty that the vegan is making that statement (the cruelty of the industry and environmental impacts are objective), the meat eater is possibly going to feel like they are being judged or attacked.
Respond to right wing reactionaries who go out of their way to complain about vegans simply with “😇💌Triggered”
There. Now you are the Good Vegan™️
“What makes a “good vegan”, and how can I be one?”
huh… not eating/consuming animal-related products?
you don’t have to be good, and you don’t have to apologize or explain your choices. the vegans who are jerks about it are right. their choices to act in ways which alienate them sometimes are their own. you can do the same or not. thanks for being vegan, either way
Not by asking non vegans. Vegans are the voice for the voiceless and you’re taking part in a boycott that challenge peoples core beliefs. To be a good vegan is to push back and disturb social cohesion which people do not like. I’m not a vegan to make friends, I’m vegan to do the right thing.
Don’t superglue yourself to burger king counters while holding a tablet playing a meat grinder video.
Don’t follow random people and film them to ridicule them online for buying McDonald’s.
Don’t steal homeless people’s dogs and put them up for adoption.
Don’t block traffic.
Don’t shame anyone for eating meat and animal products.
Don’t block entrances to restaurants that serve animal products. Don’t bang on the windows or shine bright lights into the restaurant either.
Don’t act like words like bacon, beef, venison, sausage, pork, etc. are slurs or swear words.
Don’t hide the fact that a dish has vegan alternatives, that’s not going to make someone realize it’s Not As Hard Of A Change!!! Those alternatives usually have allergens most wouldn’t expect if it were name the regular way. Who expects soy or nuts in a hot chocolate or chicken nugget?
Just exist and don’t be a dick. Anyone who has a problem with a vegan just existing is an asshole, don’t waste time with them. But if the association with Those Vegans™ still sucks, then just say it’s your religious belief. But then again if you have the emotional energy, you should denounce and call out the toxic vegans and help destroy the negative impression.
You mean vegans should be silent about your awful choices
Yeah I fucking hate climate activists for the same reasons.
And human rights activists. Just let me buy my child labour diamonds in peace.
Glad to see another kindred spirit.
Yeah that’s a really good example, this entire comment right here. Don’t do this.
As someone who deals with lactose intolerance.
Just don’t make it a big deal, if you can’t eat something, don’t eat it. Your needs are important, but other people are equally entitled to their own enjoyment.
I hate vegans who only do it to virtue signal, it is a personal journey keep it that way.
If someone is thoughtful enough to ask about your dietary requirements, they are probably “good people” and won’t care about it. They will just make allowances for you.
An anecdote about dietary requirements:
I have a sister in law who cannot eat onions/garlic/leeks etc… she does make a big deal about it, no dishes can have those ingredients when she is around.
Her intolerance is about at bad as mine, she gets bloated and gassy… So not dangerous, just uncomfortable.
It always feels difficult to deal with. My view is, if you want to make potatoes with cream sauce, enjoy it I’ll eat something else.I was vegan for about 8 years. I just don’t bring it up often. I don’t tell people I am a vegetarian. It’s not a bragging point. It’s just one part of who I am. Don’t make it your whole identity.
Totally this. I have friends who are vegan, everyone in our group knows they’re vegan, and they never stand in judgment of those of us who eat meat or talk about being vegan or why they’re vegan unless they’re asked. Simply modeling their diet with total non-judgment has made them some of the best ambassadors for veganism I’ve ever met. Almost all of us have reduced our meat consumption over time as a result
Honestly I don’t care what you want to eat. It’s your body, you can shove whatever you like into it.
Where vegans become a problem is where they’re being evangelical about their beliefs and trying to force their audience to feel the same shock and horror as they feel when contemplating the meat industry. If all I hear from you is restricted to when I offer you food and ask if you have any dietary requirements, and is of the form “I’m vegan”, that’s absolutely fine. If we’re friends I’ll adjust the menu for you, although you might have to accept it’s only your plate that gets veganified.
You going “eww” and talking about “rotting corpses” or whatever is where it becomes a problem. If I’ve asked, obviously I’ve brought your response upon myself but you should still tone it down for the non-vegans. “I’ve looked into the meat industry and I didn’t like what I saw” would be a good first response; make sure not to release any gory details unless people are really pressing you for that level of detail.
That said, none of this is based on actual experience of offensively evangelical vegans. I’ve heard they exist but haven’t met one yet. I’ve known some people for quite a while before finding out they’re vegan, veggie or whatever.
It’s not a belief. Animals being sentient is a fact. Animal agriculture being inefficient and wasteful is a fact. Animal products not being necessary for our survival is a fact.
Now you could argue that killing sentient beings is OK, but then that’s a weird moral position. And nevertheless, not a belief
“This is how you should advocate for veganism. I should know because it didn’t work for me.”